Anthony Cooke

Hello, I have just bought a 1996 9000 CS eco. It's my first Saab and I think
it's great.

It is running fine under normal conditions but when I go to overtake the
fuel cuts out as soon as the turbo kicks in. Someone has suggested that an
APC Solenoid or control box has gone bad and is protecting the engine when
it doesn't need to. The problem starts at around 3500 revs but only if I'm
heavy footed.

Could anyone tell me a little more about these gadgets and how to test them
and source them cheaply for replacement.

Thank you in advance,
Anthony

Fred W.

"Anthony Cooke" <ant7t5@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
news:407d562a$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
> You're right Fred, it doesn't have a boost gauge. It seems to cut out with
a
> jolt as soon as I feel the extra power from the turbo spinning up. It
feels
> like a rev limiter kicking in.
>

Darn, you guys are right. I did not notice the lpt in the subject line.
That will make it a bit tougher to troubleshoot at home, but all of the
troubleshooting steps should be similar. Unfortunately, I have never owned
an lpt so I can't speak from experience.

-Fred W

Johannes H Andersen

Anthony Cooke wrote:
>
> Hello, I have just bought a 1996 9000 CS eco. It's my first Saab and I think
> it's great.
>
> It is running fine under normal conditions but when I go to overtake the
> fuel cuts out as soon as the turbo kicks in. Someone has suggested that an
> APC Solenoid or control box has gone bad and is protecting the engine when
> it doesn't need to. The problem starts at around 3500 revs but only if I'm
> heavy footed.
>
> Could anyone tell me a little more about these gadgets and how to test them
> and source them cheaply for replacement.
>
> Thank you in advance,
> Anthony

Could be a sticking wastegate valve. You get overboost and the APC cuts the
fuel to protect (or limit) the engine.

LauraK

>It is running fine under normal conditions but when I go to overtake the
>fuel cuts out as soon as the turbo kicks in. Someone has suggested that an
>APC Solenoid or control box has gone bad and is protecting the engine when
>it doesn't need to. The problem starts at around 3500 revs but only if I'm
>heavy footed.

On the LPT (Light Pressure Turbo), the turbo doesn't kick in. It's on all the
time. It works similar to variable power steering. There's less boost at low
speeds, more when you need it. But it's always there.
My 1995 9000CS LPT has the smoothest power curve I've experienced on a car.
Give it more gas and it simply goes faster very fast.
I tested a 1997 9000 with regular turbo when I bought the 1995. The feel
between the two is very different. That turbo you can feel kicking in.
Unfortunately, I can't tell you how to fix yours -- but I'm sure someone else
can.


laurak@madmousergraphics.com
http://www.madmousergraphics.com
web design, print design, photography

Anthony Cooke

sticking wastegate valve.... Does anyone know how I would test it? I could
spend a fortune fault finding (well, I could if I had a fortune)

I have to agree with Johannes, it does feel very smooth and powerful until
the APC shuts me down. I know I'm going to enjoy my Saab.

"Johannes H Andersen" <johs@sizefitter_0_0_0_0_.com> wrote in message
news:407D8523.C0D88132@sizefitter_0_0_0_0_.com...
>
>
> Anthony Cooke wrote:
> >
> > Hello, I have just bought a 1996 9000 CS eco. It's my first Saab and I
think
> > it's great.
> >
> > It is running fine under normal conditions but when I go to overtake
the
> > fuel cuts out as soon as the turbo kicks in. Someone has suggested that
an
> > APC Solenoid or control box has gone bad and is protecting the engine
when
> > it doesn't need to. The problem starts at around 3500 revs but only if
I'm
> > heavy footed.
> >
> > Could anyone tell me a little more about these gadgets and how to test
them
> > and source them cheaply for replacement.
> >
> > Thank you in advance,
> > Anthony
>
> Could be a sticking wastegate valve. You get overboost and the APC cuts
the
> fuel to protect (or limit) the engine.

Dexter J

Salutations:

On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 23:41:39 +0100, Anthony Cooke <ant7t5@tiscali.co.uk>
wrote:

> sticking wastegate valve.... Does anyone know how I would test it? I
> could
> spend a fortune fault finding (well, I could if I had a fortune)
>

Sorry for dropping in on the thread so late. In my 89 non-DI 9000 I (and
two previous owners) had exactly the same trouble - it turned out to be a
basic ignition problem. Under boost a seal was leaking oil onto a spark
lead and grounding it out momentarily so suddenly and quite violently -
the engine management system would cut in assuming a knock. The previous
owner had rebuilt the tranny and replaced the turbo outright to no avail
and my shop only figured it out by accident as the same sort of grounding
situation sometimes occurred on Buicks with a distributor head mounted
sideways.

You are running DI in that unit I know - but perhaps you want to swap out
your plugs and test for grounds. Check around for excess oil under the DI,
see if the control wires are clean and tidy and have the DI tested. I'd
also pull apart any wire couplings I could find right back to the APC
checking for corrosion too.

It may very well be the wastegate and/or a problem with the
battery/alternator and/or the APC computer - but I'd confirm the ignition
system first given that the knock management system seems to kick in given
almost any variation in firing.

Cheers and best wishes.

--

J Dexter - webmaster - http://www.dexterdyne.org/
all tunes - no cookies no subscription no weather no ads
no news no phone in - RealAudio 8+ Required - all the Time

Radio Free Dexterdyne Top Tune o'be-do-da-day
En Vogue Salt n Pepa - What a Mighty Good Man
http://www.dexterdyne.org/888/168.RAM

Andy

Hi,

I have a 1995 LPT 2.0 CS, and this does exactly the same thing. Except it
does not do it all the time. More recently I have found that it starts on 3
cylinders only, then after a period of a few seconds to 1 minute, it starts
running normally. I am suspecting the 2 faults are connected, and are due
to some grounding or connection problem.

I have been told the DI unit is the likely culprit, but it has made no
difference to my Saab when it was changed.

But if you find a solution, please be sure to let us know.

Best Regards and Luck.

Andrew

"Anthony Cooke" <ant7t5@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
news:407d1dae$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
> Hello, I have just bought a 1996 9000 CS eco. It's my first Saab and I
think
> it's great.
>
> It is running fine under normal conditions but when I go to overtake
the
> fuel cuts out as soon as the turbo kicks in. Someone has suggested that an
> APC Solenoid or control box has gone bad and is protecting the engine when
> it doesn't need to. The problem starts at around 3500 revs but only if I'm
> heavy footed.
>
> Could anyone tell me a little more about these gadgets and how to test
them
> and source them cheaply for replacement.
>
> Thank you in advance,
> Anthony
>
>

KeithG

In your case, if the DI was changed and it still runs on 3 then 4 cyl
upon startup, it may be a head gasket starting to go. My 900 did that
before I replaced the head gasket. Does the coolant level drop slowly
over time?

As for the original post, If the car accelerates very hard, it may be
the sticking wastegate. Mine was an lpt, and it just feels like a 3l v6
or so. It does not feel like 'Wow, this thing is fast', it feels like
'This thing is adequate, no more'.

To sets the theory, you'll need some 1/4" hose and a hand pump (bike
tire pump, soccer ball pump). disconnect the existing hose from the
wastegate actuator and hook the new hose there. If you can suck on the
hose and it is free, no resistance, the actuator is bad and must be
replaced. Now, pressurize it with the pump. If it moves, it is probably
fine. If not, remove the actuator arm from the wastegate arm and see if
it will move now, under pressure. If so, the wastegate itself is stuck
and needs to be freed? My bets are on the actuator.

Good luck,

KeithG

Andy wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I have a 1995 LPT 2.0 CS, and this does exactly the same thing. Except it
> does not do it all the time. More recently I have found that it starts on 3
> cylinders only, then after a period of a few seconds to 1 minute, it starts
> running normally. I am suspecting the 2 faults are connected, and are due
> to some grounding or connection problem.
>
> I have been told the DI unit is the likely culprit, but it has made no
> difference to my Saab when it was changed.
>
> But if you find a solution, please be sure to let us know.
>
> Best Regards and Luck.
>
> Andrew
>
> "Anthony Cooke" <ant7t5@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:407d1dae$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
>
>>Hello, I have just bought a 1996 9000 CS eco. It's my first Saab and I
>
> think
>
>>it's great.
>>
>>It is running fine under normal conditions but when I go to overtake
>
> the
>
>>fuel cuts out as soon as the turbo kicks in. Someone has suggested that an
>>APC Solenoid or control box has gone bad and is protecting the engine when
>>it doesn't need to. The problem starts at around 3500 revs but only if I'm
>>heavy footed.
>>
>>Could anyone tell me a little more about these gadgets and how to test
>
> them
>
>>and source them cheaply for replacement.
>>
>>Thank you in advance,
>>Anthony
>>
>>
>
>
>

Anthony Cooke

Thanks Keith,

that is exactly the kind of advise I was after. Pipes and handpumps it is.
I'm not adverse to spending money but I didn't want to have to replace the
whole lot.I'll see if I can diagnose it using your method.

Anthony


"KeithG" <noone@wowway.com> wrote in message
news:5JWdnWX3Nqsc9-PdRVn-hQ@wideopenwest.com...
> In your case, if the DI was changed and it still runs on 3 then 4 cyl
> upon startup, it may be a head gasket starting to go. My 900 did that
> before I replaced the head gasket. Does the coolant level drop slowly
> over time?
>
> As for the original post, If the car accelerates very hard, it may be
> the sticking wastegate. Mine was an lpt, and it just feels like a 3l v6
> or so. It does not feel like 'Wow, this thing is fast', it feels like
> 'This thing is adequate, no more'.
>
> To sets the theory, you'll need some 1/4" hose and a hand pump (bike
> tire pump, soccer ball pump). disconnect the existing hose from the
> wastegate actuator and hook the new hose there. If you can suck on the
> hose and it is free, no resistance, the actuator is bad and must be
> replaced. Now, pressurize it with the pump. If it moves, it is probably
> fine. If not, remove the actuator arm from the wastegate arm and see if
> it will move now, under pressure. If so, the wastegate itself is stuck
> and needs to be freed? My bets are on the actuator.
>
> Good luck,
>
> KeithG
>
> Andy wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have a 1995 LPT 2.0 CS, and this does exactly the same thing. Except
it
> > does not do it all the time. More recently I have found that it starts
on 3
> > cylinders only, then after a period of a few seconds to 1 minute, it
starts
> > running normally. I am suspecting the 2 faults are connected, and are
due
> > to some grounding or connection problem.
> >
> > I have been told the DI unit is the likely culprit, but it has made no
> > difference to my Saab when it was changed.
> >
> > But if you find a solution, please be sure to let us know.
> >
> > Best Regards and Luck.
> >
> > Andrew
> >
> > "Anthony Cooke" <ant7t5@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:407d1dae$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
> >
> >>Hello, I have just bought a 1996 9000 CS eco. It's my first Saab and I
> >
> > think
> >
> >>it's great.
> >>
> >>It is running fine under normal conditions but when I go to overtake
> >
> > the
> >
> >>fuel cuts out as soon as the turbo kicks in. Someone has suggested that
an
> >>APC Solenoid or control box has gone bad and is protecting the engine
when
> >>it doesn't need to. The problem starts at around 3500 revs but only if
I'm
> >>heavy footed.
> >>
> >>Could anyone tell me a little more about these gadgets and how to test
> >
> > them
> >
> >>and source them cheaply for replacement.
> >>
> >>Thank you in advance,
> >>Anthony
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >

Johannes H Andersen

LauraK wrote:
>
> >It is running fine under normal conditions but when I go to overtake the
> >fuel cuts out as soon as the turbo kicks in. Someone has suggested that an
> >APC Solenoid or control box has gone bad and is protecting the engine when
> >it doesn't need to. The problem starts at around 3500 revs but only if I'm
> >heavy footed.
>
> On the LPT (Light Pressure Turbo), the turbo doesn't kick in. It's on all the
> time. It works similar to variable power steering. There's less boost at low
> speeds, more when you need it. But it's always there.
> My 1995 9000CS LPT has the smoothest power curve I've experienced on a car.
> Give it more gas and it simply goes faster very fast.
> I tested a 1997 9000 with regular turbo when I bought the 1995. The feel
> between the two is very different. That turbo you can feel kicking in.
> Unfortunately, I can't tell you how to fix yours -- but I'm sure someone else
> can.

I still think it is a sticking waste gate valve, but it is just one possibility.
If you potter around within urban speed limits all the time, then the waste gate
will rarely function, and it can jam. If it doesn't open when required at
high boost, then the ECU or APC or whatever cuts off the full supply. It can be
annoying when you're draw into the drivers seat and the power suddenly and
unexpectedly disappears, then the spring loading of the seat catapults you
forward on the windscreen. This is my theory anyway, it happened to my 1993
9000 lpt some years ago. But it has been so flawless for quite a while that I'm
beginning to worry.